Dave Kopay.

The first pro football player to come out is surprised that 23 years later, few have followed

Dave Kopay--out in the open blared a headline in the Washington Star in December 1975. With that the all-pro Washington Redskins running back instantly became the gay Jackie Robinson, apparently breaking down barriers for legions of gay and lesbian athletes. At the time Kopay, who had also played with the San Francisco 49ers, Detroit Lions, Green Bay Packers, and New Orleans Saints, appeared destined to be just the first of many professional team sports athletes to make similar declarations. Roy Simmons, a former New York Giants tackle, and former Oakland A's outfielder Glenn Burke eventually did join Kopay. But that the group remains so small nearly 23 years after Kopay's coming-out speaks volumes about both Kopay's fortitude and the stranglehold homophobia retains on professional team sports.

Indeed, the pro sports closet shows few signs of opening anytime soon. In August of last year, for instance, a member of the Redskins pummeled another player for calling him a faggot. Less than four months later, two prominent members of the Washington Wizards pro basketball team came to blows when one called the other a homosexual, an episode taped by a woman who knew them. Finally, in a March 25 speech to the Wisconsin legislature, all-pro Green Bay Packers defensive end Reggie White, who is also a minister, equated gay men and lesbians with "liars, cheaters," and people who are "malicious and backstabbing." Additionally, White called homosexuality a sin that has contributed to the decline of Western civilization.

Though Kopay crone out after his retirement, gay fans count him as a genuine hero. The Advocate spoke to Kopay, 56, who is now a sales manager for a floor-covering firm in Los Angeles, about his life since coming out, the pro sports closet, and Dallas Cowboys star quarterback Troy Aikman. Shortly before the interview Kopay had returned from the International Conference on Ethical Issues in Sport, sponsored by the University of South Florida in Tampa, where he was a featured speaker. Single, Kopay lives in a spacious condominium in the Los Feliz area of Los Angeles, just blocks from Madonna and Lily Tomlin. On weekends the still-buffed Kopay can often be found lounging by the pool at the Palm Springs, Calif., home he shares with two friends.

"I wish I could get across to gay athletes just how rewarding it is to come out," he says. "It is the greatest feeling imaginable when a kid comes up to you and tells you how much what you did meant to them. It's a reward that goes well beyond all the heartache."

What did you think of Reggie White's comments?

I felt it was like yelling fire in a crowded theater. It enforces the notion among kids, especially high school athletes, that gay men are perverts, that, we are these exotic things that deserve to be bashed and beaten. I was very disappointed that Nike [corporation chairman] Phil Knight didn't make a stronger statement about what Reggie said. [White has an endorsement contract with Nike.] In his heart, I think, Reggie is a decent person; there are just a lot of things he doesn't under stand. And he's being used by white men who hate homosexuals. The National Football League needs to take him on and get caught up to the 1990s.

What did you learn at the Ethical Issues in Sport confab?

I was impressed with the sports journalism there. They seemed to really understand the homophobia in sports and why it's wrong. I spoke to [former Minnesota Viking] Alan Page, who was a great player and a great man. He's now a member of the [Minnesota] state supreme court. He's very good about the issue. And I was very surprised to find [former University of Kentucky head football coach] Bill Curry to be really sympathetic. He told me that I was 20 years ahead of my time and that it had taken his wife 20 years to get him to give up his hateful beliefs. And this is a guy who was a very conservative Fellowship of Christian Athletes member. That means things are starting to change. We hear only about the Reggie Whites, but there are also more and more Bill Currys out there.

How have you been treated since you came out?

I have a fabulous life. I've got a home in the desert and friends who are like extended family. I enjoy my job, and from my condo I have a great view of much of Los Angeles. I don't have a lover, but I have many loves.

All in all it's been a very rewarding life because I've been able to make a difference. That's something they can never take away from you. That's something a lot of retired athletes can't say.

My main regret is that I was basically frozen out of coaching jobs because I'm gay. I couldn't even get an interview. The other regret is that Jerry Smith isn't here to go through this with me. [The Redskins all-pro tight end died of complications from AIDS in 1986.] If he had lived, he and I were going to do this together. I would have had someone to help me deal with Anita Bryant and all that bullshit as a gay athlete. But he took his secret with him to his grave.

In a January article in GQ magazine, David Kamp takes you to task for failing to be an effective advocate for the gay cause within pro sports. What's your response?

I have not felt all that comfortable as an activist. It's true I have never sat down with NFL executives to talk about the issue. I was sort of hoping people would take that on without me, that I would simply be the spark. I did meet for two hours with [NFL Players Association executive director] Gene Upshaw. I asked him why the pension plan would not provide benefits for my significant other, if I had one. I pointed out that the San Francisco 49ers had adopted such a policy, so why couldn't he bring that up with the NFL? I played ball with Gene Upshaw in the Oakland Raiders camp, and I think he is open-minded. He was gracious and seemed to understand what I was saying.

I'm feeling ready to become more involved. I've had a successful career in football and now in sales, and it's time to do more. I follow gay politics closely. I think [Human Rights Campaign executive director] Elizabeth Birch is terrific. Maybe I will work more closely with her. Maybe there is some sort of sports project I could head up. They have them for every other issue.

What do you think of the rumors about Troy Aikman that Skip Bayless printed in his book [Hell-Bent: The Crazy Truth About the "Win or Else" Dallas Cowboys]?

Everyone asks me which quarterbacks were gay. I always say, "I don't know; I've never slept with any." Well, the same applies to Troy. But let me tell you a stow about him. In the GQ article, I was quoted, accurately, saying "Would I do Troy Aikman on Sunset Strip? Yes! That would be my fantasy!" Well, a couple of days after the article was published, I was flying to Dallas for a buying trip or something. Into the terminal in L.A. comes Troy Aikman. We both got sidetracked and were the last people on the plane. I wanted to introduce myself, but he was being bothered by kids. He was being gracious but obviously wanted privacy. He ks as gorgeous in person as he ks on TV. So I went up to him and said, "My name is Dave Kopay, and I used to play pro ball." Then I told him what I said in the article. I said, "I don't apologize for what I said, but I do apologize for it if it caused you pain." He just smiled and said, "Dave, don't worry about it. I look forward to reading it." To me, his reaction--he didn't have a clue--meant to me that he ks not gay. He just seemed totally unconcerned. Of course, he could simply have been very good at concealing his true feelings. I know it's not politically correct in the gay community to say that Troy is not gay, but I have a sense that he's not. Then again, you never know for sure. He could be gay.

Have closeted gay athletes sought you out for advice?

One major star called me a few years back and told me he was bisexual. But he was also married with kids. We talked about it, and he concluded that it was simply too complicated to come out right then. His priority was his family. I told him, "Fine, I understand." I know a lot of people would think what he said was a cop-out, but I don't think so. The problem is not in individual athletes but in the repression of the sport itself. Gay athletes simply live in fear of what would happen to their careers. I know myself, as a borderline player who made the roster year after year, that it was always easy for [the team] to find someone else. And if I had come out during my career, management would have found someone else. All an athlete has to do is look at someone like James Hormel, who is qualified to be an ambassador but can't get through the Senate because he ks gay. Guys pick up on stuff like that.

What would happen if a major athlete were to come out?

It takes only one person to break down the barrier. If a major star were to finally come out at the height of his career, it would revolutionize America. It would mean a society with a lot less hatred, a lot less bigotry. He would be under tremendous pressure. But pros are used to performing under pressure anyway. Look at the pressure Michael Jordan faces to keep winning. No one can tell me it would be worse than that. It would be tough, but the player, if he were the right person, would survive. I've heard some great stories about professional hockey players. Maybe it will happen there, in a sport that's just a little more liberal. It's going to happen. It might take another 50 years, but it's going to happen.